A Practical Guide to Paying A Shiva Call

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A Practical Guide to Paying A Shiva Call

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When one pays a shiva call, the focus is on comforting the mourners in their time of greatest grief. Traditionally, one enters the shiva house quietly with a small knock so as not to startle those inside. No one needs to greet visitors; they simply enter on their own.

Food or drinks are not laid out for the visitors, because the mourners are not hosts. They do not greet the visitors, rise for them, or see them out.

When entering the house, you should not greet the mourners. In fact, it is best to come in silently and sit down close to them. Take your cue from the mourners. If they feel like speaking, let them indicate it by speaking first. Let them lead and talk about what they want to talk about. It is best to speak about the one who has passed away, and if you have any stories or memories to share with the mourner, this is the time to do so.

This is not a time to distract them from mourning. Out of nervousness, we often make small talk because we do not know what to say. Don't fill in the time talking about happy subjects or inconsequential topics like politics or business.

Often, the best thing to say is nothing. A shiva call can sometimes be completely silent. If the mourner does not feel like talking at that time, so be it. Your goal is not to get them to talk; it is to comfort them. Your presence alone is doing that. By sitting there silently, you are saying more than words can. You are saying: "I am here for you. I feel your pain. There are no words."

And sometimes there aren't any. Here are examples of things not to say:

• "How are you?" (They're not so good.)

• "I know how you feel." (No you don't. Each person feels a unique loss.)

• "At least she lived a long life." (Longer would have been better.)

• "It's good that you have other children," or, "Don't worry, you'll have more." (The loss of a child, no matter what age, is completely devastating.)

• "Cheer up – in a few months you'll meet someone new." (He/she has just lost the other half of their soul!)

• "Let's talk about happy things." (Maybe later.)

Remember that speaking about the loved one they lost is comforting. It's alright if they cry; they are in mourning. It is all part of the important process of coming to grips with such a loss.

You should not overstay your visit. Twenty minutes will suffice. When other visitors arrive and space is a concern, it is certainly time to leave.

Before leaving, one stands up, approaches the mourner and recites, "HaMakom yenacheim etchem betoch sha'ar aveiliei Tzion v'Yerushalayim" -- May the Almighty comfort you among those who mourn for Zion and Jerusalem. One can read this phrase from a sheet of paper.

Upon leaving the house of the mourner, it is customary to give charity in memory of the one who passed away, may his soul be elevated.

Excerpted from "Remember My Soul," by Lori Palatnik

Click here for a pdf version of this article.

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Published: Saturday, November 1, 2008

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Visitor Comments: 21

(21) leah, June 10, 2010 4:18 PM

less time

Having recently sat shiva & having a friend who just lost a 24 year old son, I would amend the shiva visit time to 5-10 minutes unless you are close to the deceased or ones sitting shiva. If you cannot bring much comfort then pay your respects & leave.In Washington Heights, the Breuer community keeps shiva visits to a minumum of time. If you see another visitor you want to catch up with,finish your visit & go outside to talk.

(20) Shmuel Zev, June 9, 2010 4:52 PM

What to talk about

When the conversation is not going well or the topic has been derailed to something trivial and inappropriate for Shiva, I try to the following comments: Tell me about the deceased What have you learned or would like to transmit from the deceased. Almost invariably, this leads to more questions and discussion that is comforting for the mourner and satisfying for those paying their respects.

(19) Anonymous, June 9, 2010 3:41 PM

other customs

this guide is a very good intro. it does not take into account the sephadic minhag of eating with the mourners or eating and drinking while in the Shiva home. we are ashkenzim but my brother A"H lived in a mixed community and befriended many Sephardim, mostly Greek origin. they take it seriously to say a bracha over food in the Shiva house as a merit for the Neshama of the deceased. also, the 2 times I sat shiva I was VERY appreciative of people who sent a short note of condolence during or after shiva, espeicially if they were able to share a quick memory about the departed loved one.

(18) Anonymous, June 8, 2010 3:28 PM

My husband lost his brother after Purim and I was amazed at how many times my sister-in-law went through the whole story of hiss illness and Petirah! However, she seemed to find it cathartic although I don't know whether the children did. On a separate note, my father ZT"L, was nifter in 1994 and I still have people telling me how much they miss him and how wonderful he was to them in various crisis in their lives. So, I feel like he is still with us in so many ways!

(17) Yitz, June 8, 2010 2:39 PM

Spharadim serve food

I spharadi neighbor indeed served food for the visitors. She put up a sign explaining that it is considered a merit for the deceased to have the visitors say a blessing and eat. (FYI - let's not forget that spharadim are Jewish as well).

(16) Namrata, December 22, 2009 7:21 AM

Nice post thank you for sharing the information

(15) Anonymous, January 11, 2009 1:16 AM

the importance of later communication

Those who wrote about the importance of maintaining contact with the family after the shiva hit the nail on the head. My grandmother was nifteres a few months back, and every now and then we get calls from people, checking up on us to see how we are. Even if people don't do anything per se, the caring makes a difference. Someone I know recently lost her husband. While one of my reasons for keeping in touch with her is for my own benefit, I also want her to know that I care. Another important point, in connection to a previous comment: people like to hear memories about their relative, even later on. Of course, you have to judge the situation to know when to speak. Some people asked me, "How old was your grandmother?" and then, "That's young." Well, thanks. How is that going to help anything? Okay, to each their own . . .

(14) Anonymous, December 2, 2008 9:30 PM

woops

yeah ,i went to a shiva last month and thought i was supposed to make as many brachos as possible because the only shiva call ive ever been to was sephardic so i picked up a piece a food..and then some one told me not to eat their food it was very embarresing to say the least.

(13) Anonymous, November 8, 2008 5:03 PM

Great advice

This is a great article. I would just like to add that mourners need support after Shiva is over. After my father passed away, we had many visitors and phone calls during shiva, but afterwards there was nothing. I remember how lonely and hurt my mother felt - at the time she was feeling alone and vulnerable after losing her other half, and having to deal with changes in her financial situation, she got no support from friends. A weekly phone call and occasional visit can make a big difference.

(12) Anonymous, November 7, 2008 12:43 AM

I would like to quote a well known Rav who has spoken on this topic. LISTEN and SILENT contain the same letters. Let us hope and pray that individuals will never need to refer to this information.

(11) BTDT, November 4, 2008 8:43 PM

Don't critique!

I've recently read complaints from people who were upset because the mourners were not good hosts. No, those were not the exact words, but that's exactly what it came down to. I found it incredible. Also, do NOT critique the care the niftar received, the levaya or anything else related. Don't even ask questions like "did she get good care?" etc. If there were any problems, you can be sure that the family is hurting enough over the issue. And, unless you were privy to every part of every decision that was made, you really are not in any position to judge. Besides, even if you are 100% correct, there is NO practical point, so no justification for the hurt it causes.

(10) Anonymous, November 3, 2008 3:24 PM

Great article, but just one point

That was a really good guide to what to do at a shiva and the reason behind it which many people need reminding of. Just one point, Sephardim have a custom that one should say as many blessings as you can in the merit of the deceased and therefore often provide quite a lot of food of all the various types.

(9) Batsheva, November 3, 2008 8:28 AM

Advice to anonymous

I think your friend would appreciate a kind note from you explaining that you only recently heard about her loss, offering your condolences, and offering her your friendship and availability if she ever needs to talk. After the shiva and the shloshim, mourners still need support. People tend to forget this as we move on with our own lives.

(8) michael, November 2, 2008 3:31 PM

Right on

Thank you Lori for this most correct guidance on shiva.
In North America I remember the shiva homes as noisy and somewhat disrespectful.
In Israel 3 weeks ago just before Succot,my mother passed away.
The burial was a few hours before the holiday and I organised mincha at my home
at lunchtime.
A large group attended-the chief rabbi of the town arrived first and his presence lent a dignified atmosphere.
Just as you mentioned-everyone sat silently at first.The rabbi began asking the origins of my late mother which got me speaking.
We proceeded with davening.The strong response of the crowd to the kaddish brought an emotional wave of comfort over me.I returned to my low seat after
the service and the rabbi gave a short
drasha mentioning that he did not know the deceased but by knowing her family he could imagine the home she had kept.
It was a few words that meant so much.
Thereafter,he wished me in the traditional fashion,everyone else lined up and repeated the same line,some in hebrew and some in english.
Because of the chag,that one hour was the only shiva I was allowed-but it was so full and meaningful that I didn''t feel that I needed more.

(7) Rachel, November 2, 2008 2:45 PM

Good advice

This is helpful advice. I would add that while it follows Ashkenazi Orthodox etiquette, the most important thing when paying a shiva call is to take your cue from the mourners. Some people don't want to talk about the deceased, others do. I once entered a shiva house and went to extend my condolences to the deceased man's son, I quickly looked around the room and realized that in this very frum household, women and men sat separately so after a word with my friend, I joined his wife and mother and spoke with the widow about what a wonderful family she and her late husband had raised (even though I'd never met the man, he lives on in his wonderful son and grandchildren.) I also think that a heartfelt "how are you doing?" is ok -- it gives the mourner the opportunity to tell you about what s/he is going through (I was raised not to impose my feelings on others unless they asked first.) This is not to suggest that the kind of flip "how ya doin' today?" that is routinely, meaninglessly asked by store clerks of perfect strangers is acceptable. And when the mourner tells you about feelings, or about the loved one's last days, YES, just respond sympathetically. I lost my mother recently, a couple of people told me she was "better off". No, actually -- she had only been ill for a week, she had not been in pain, and while I accept that we leave when Hashem determines it's our time, to me that's not the same thing as believing that my beloved mother is "better off dead". And I'm not better off without her. I love her and miss her terribly, and the people who came were most comforting who said things like "I know how much you loved her, I know how much she loved you, she was a wonderful person and I will miss her very much." I forgive those who said other things, but I feel that part of this comes from American culture's lack of proper behavior. My kids are no doubt sick of hearing me tell them things that "no one does anymore" -- but it DOES matter that one know how to say the right things at a shiva call -- or a wedding, how to introduce acquaintances of yours to others, how to eat properly at a dinner table or a restaurant, etc. Ultimately, this is not about snobbishness, it's about treating other people decently and kindly.

(6) Marsha, November 2, 2008 1:17 PM

Thank you!

For providing information everyone should know. For "anonymous #3" I would suggest that when you are alone with your friend you tell her what you told us - how sorry you are for her loss. My father was prominent in his community and when people tell me they still think about how beautiful his "layning" was it still makes me feel good, even 14 years after his passing, because it shows that even outside our family he is not forgotten.I personally try not to make shiva calls at night when everyone else is there.

(5) Tracey S., November 2, 2008 11:41 AM

How true

I recently lost my mother, and while most people were respectful, I realized that no one spoke about my mother except to ask if she had been sick. And some friends treated the situation as if it were some kind of crazy party. The worst were two phone calls I received. One was from a family member who kept telling me about how awful I should feel (it was like she was digging a knife into me) and another from a family friend for whom my mother did many things, often sacrificing her vacation to drive this woman's husband to and from the hospital. This person didn't talk about my mother at all! And none of the people she considered friends came or called. (None of them came to the funeral even though I made sure it was held a location they could get to.) While I had some issues with my mother, I would have hoped to have heard some positive, loving things from others so that I would've known whether my mother's life had made a difference. Sorry if I sound petty, but it was very upsetting and eye-opening.

(4) Anonymous, November 2, 2008 11:28 AM

super - I am grateful to HKB and to Aish for being able to view this.

I heard you speak recently. I came up to and said "Lori Almost Live". You were wonderful and soooo inspirational. I want to read your books. What you are doing is so important now. I am in awe of someone who has been chosen by Hashem to do this important work.

(3) Anonymous, November 2, 2008 11:03 AM

I Missed Shivah

I am friendly with a person at school who lost her father. For a few years, I have seen her just about everyday, and we talk and try to give each other support in whatever we are doing, but I haven't actually been in any of her classes. I feel that we are friends, even though we only see each other at school in the halls or at lunch. Recently, one of her classmates told me that this girl's father had recently died, but they told me after shivah and even after the 30-day mourning period had ended. I saw her the next day, and everyday since, but I just don't know what to do. I haven't avoided her, but I have avoided the topic of her father's passing. I have followed her lead, talking about whatever she talks about: nothing heavy. She may not know that I am even aware of her situation, as I am not actually her classmate and, therefore, did not get the news along with her other peers. I want her to know that I care. I want her to know that she can come to me with this. But I don't know what to do at this point (I haven't brought it up, but neither has she!). If she feels like she's in a comfortable place where she doesn't have to face that part of her reality, when she sees me around, I wouldn't want to break that. I don't want to make her break down crying... Crying is healthy in this case, but I am sure she's doing that in the privacy of her own home-- not at school. I don't know her address, and I don't know what to do! Does anyone have any ideas???

(2) Anonymous, November 2, 2008 10:17 AM

other customs

In many Sefardic communities is it customary to have food put out for the visitors, in order that they make blessings on the food in the merit of the soul of the deceased. It can be very offensive to the Sefardic mourners if this food is refused.

(1) lisa, November 2, 2008 7:48 AM

SO TRUE!!!!!

I wish everyone would adhere to these "rules." The same could be true for visiting the sick....don't ask too many questions & limit your stay to 10-15 minutes!! I once had a vistor come for one hour...OUCH!!!! Then I wondered was she visiting me for my sake or for hers. Yasher Koach to Lori P.!!

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About the Author

Mrs. Lori Palatnik

Lori Palatnik is an author and Jewish educator who has appeared on television and radio and has lectured on five continents, illuminating traditional practices and life-styles for our contemporary world. She and her husband, Rabbi Yaakov Palatnik, live in Washington, DC, where she is Executive Director of the Jewish Women's Renaissance Project. Lori is the author of "Friday Night and Beyond—The Shabbat Experience Step-by-Step"; "Remember My Soul", which explains the Jewish concepts of soul and the afterlife and a guide to anyone who has ever lost a loved one; and "Gossip—Ten Pathways to Eliminate It From Your Life and Transform Your Soul", featured on "Dr. Laura" and FoxNews.com.