Guest Etiquette

Clean up after yourself and never, never , never leave your grungy-haired soap in the soap dish!!! Also, bring your own soap (in a soap dish) and toothpaste. Never sit in Big Daddy's recliner. Never try to remind a host that they are out of toilet paper!!! Buy some! Impress your host

This was never a practise in my social circle as a young person, and there are those who consider this now as a faux pas. It seems to indicate, to me, that the guest often sees the gift as recompense for the invitation, and does not plan to return the hospitality.
WE once brought wine to a party, and the host seemed offended. They entertained a great deal, and I think knew better than we did. In fact, at the time we thought we could not return the invitation. Fortunately, we were able to at a later date, and then none of our dinner guests brought a gift. We were glad they didn't.

Do you have any suggestions or etiquite when grown children visit home?

when a potential guest calls and invites themselves to a long weekend about 6 weeks out. Is it the host's responsibility to follow up to see if the guests are still planning to visit?

I recommend reading books by Deborah Tannen, two of which are "That's Not What I Meant", and "You Just Don't Understand", in which she shows how many misunderstandings between people can be avoided if we take into consideration the culture, custom, and language style of other people.

Some of the letter writers said they wanted guests to "help out" in various ways, or help themselves to food in the refrigerator or pantry, or even gave guests a house key. Those behaviors may be the norm in some cultures, but they are not in others. In some cultures, it is considered rude to help oneself to anything in someone else's house without asking, or waiting to be served. If those two cultures collide, you have one person hungry and thirsty, wondering why the host hasn't offered anything, and the other person thinking, why doesn't the person help him or herself if they are in need?

In some cases giving out house keys would place the security of the household in jeopardy, and it may not be wise to be handing out keys, which may then be copies, and improperly used or fall into the wrong hands. This could encourage people to overstep boundaries, and the hosts may find themselves barged in upon or their house used inappropriately.

Some people do not want guests to help for various reasons, such as that it is not seemly for guests to have to do that. The guests are not hired help, maids or butlers, and unless the host is ill or handicapped, would prefer their guests to sit and relax. If the host is frustrated by this, they should invite help, hired or not, to do the work, so the host can also sit, relax, and enjoy the company of the guests. This way, everyone could enjoy the drash being discussed and other topics of conversation.

Other reasons that help may be unwanted or unwelcome, is that guests may not know about the kosher standards of the home, which is the milk or meat side, or what to do with things.

Or the dishes may be delicate, or family heirlooms with sentimental and/or monetary value, and both the host and guest might be upset if the dishes and crystal were broken.

Do they expect the guests to wash the floors, clean the bathrooms, wash the laundry? It is nice if these activities are mutually agreed upon and appreciated, but some may feel that part of the definition of being a guest is that they are there to enjoy and be served, and both the host and guest may share this definition.

People should not jump to conclusions about other people's behaviour based on insufficient evidence of the background, culture and beliefs of the other.

Deborah Tannen's books are very helpful to gaining understanding people and being understood, and opening the lines of communication.

This is a wonderful article. I live in NYC and I do not come from a frum home. I am very much interested in learning more about Judaism. But I find people here do not want to know people that are not frum or BT and are not interested in hosting them. For example, people say to me Good Luck and they never pick up the phone to invite me to their homes for Shabbos and Yom Tov. I refuse to invite myself to people's homes because it is wrong. And I am turned off to the frum community but not to learning. So I commend you for your efforts, Emuna.

Funny enough, since I've known many people in the Kiruv community where I live for a while, I rarely have to even be invited. Everyone has patiently waited for me to become Shomer Shabbos and knew I'd call when I was ready. Every week, I call on Monday a different family, and I have a place for Shabbos. Strange, then, how these very people that just don't seem to have a clue about certain things were actually people I'd known for at least 3 years, huh ? lol :)

If I ever decide to visit Florida, though... lol :D
Daniela

How many times has it happened to us that we invite someone for a meal on Shabbos and they just don't know when to go home! Hint: Once dessert has been served, the table has been cleared, everyone has "bentched", say "thank you" and GO! If the Shabbos clock has turned the lights off, take it has a hint that your host family would like to put the kids to bed and maybe go to bed themselves. If they want you to stay longer, they'll tell you. This applies for Shabbos afternoon as well as Friday night. I don't mean to sound like a grump, but as much as people love hosting guests, people also need some "down time" with their spouses and children, and Shabbos may be the only time to get it. Guests need to know their boundaries.

When you are invited to my home on Monday for an upcoming Shabbos meal, please let me know if you're coming by Wednesday. We love having guests, and if you let us know only by Thursday night, it is often too late for us to find someone else to join us. I don't want to have to hound you daily by telephone to find out if you've decided yet about coming.

Another point, this on behalf of seminary girls learning in Israel: if you are the hostess, and you call to cancel, please first try to find a neighbor or friend to host the guest in your place. It is terribly stressful for girls to call each and every week looking for a place to spend Shabbos, and very difficult to find a placement at the last minute.

This type of article is pertinent for all of us, guests and hosts alike, to keep an awareness of the needs and sensitivities of each other. I look forward to next week's article on host's responsibilities, as I know I've stuck my hostessing foot in my mouth more than once!!

This should be taught to seminary girls in Israel because they must practice how to be good guests. They are guests every Shabbos!

You know, it says something that this article even needs to be written.

The problem in our community is getting the singles(who are mainly over 40 and old enogh to know better) to actually call us back! If I call on a Monday, I usually have to call again for an answer. Sometimes their kids' erase the messages. The ones who call back immediately and say"yes" most of the time become our "regular guests". My husband and I were both single for several years(before we met ,obviously). We always responded promptly to invitations. As for Daniela: it sounds like your getting some really lousy invitations. I've never heard of anyone sleeping with the cholent pot in the basement. Ask the rabbi to help set you up for meals. We don't have basements in Florida so you aren't close enough to come here for a meal.

Solid article, well written.

One thing to add - Many of us don't come from traditional jewish backgrounds. ie. we aren't from New York, we didn't go to Jewish summer camp, didn't go to Yeshiva U or Brandeis etc. One thing I notice at some tables is that people try to connect with others through who they know, jewish institutions they have spent time at, common summer camp backgrounds etc. Too much focus on this kind of conversation can really try the patience of other guests who don't have a "traditional jewish background" who don't know the people you are talking about, have never been to the places you are discussing and weren't fortunate enough to have the rich jewish upbringing you did. As a guest, I would just ask that people be considerate in trying limit how much time on where others at the table "have been" and focus on where each person is now and to try to find topics that are more of general interest. To clarify, I'm not asking for a total ban on jewish geography just recognise that you may be making some ba'ale tshuva feel bad by placing such importance on such topics as who you learned with in yeshiva. You may also be boring them to tears.
As a general rule, look to include not exclude. I'm glad the author also mentioned speaking in foreign languages. I've had a number of experiences where people who spoke English just fine couldn't stop themselves from speaking at length or making comments in some other language that others don't know. Of course there are exceptions to this as well. And just one more thing and I think this should be obvious. How about a smile when meeting new people? It's an obvious thing that is sometimes forgotten.

What a wonderful list! May I add to it some ideas formed as a result of some less-than-welcome guests?
#9 Don;t criticize the customs of your host and hostess
I, too, have had many guests, some welcome, some less so. One of our most memorable guests was the one who had been in Rabbi Yitzchak Berkowitz's halacha class for about two weeks. When he came to us, for his second Shabbos as a Bal Teshuva, he immediately informed my husband that he ws making kiddush incorrectly. Since my husband had been keeping Shabbos for about 15 years at that point, he politely informed the guest that there is more than one way to make kiddush (i.e. sitting, standing, wine, grape juice, etc.)
#10 - Be nice to your host's children. Once, when my son was 8 years old, he was eager to entertain our guests with his latest magic trick. Well, you can imagine the level of sophistication that an 8 year old's magic trick has. However, most of the guests watched politly and oohed and ahhed in the appropriate places. All except for one guest who thought she would be clever and expose the "trick", which she easily did. My son was terribly hurt. Needless to say, we benched quickly, sent this guest on her way and never invited her again.

We have had guests who did not offer to help serve or clear at ALL! One time my husband and I were clearing the table, and she was still sitting. It would be nice if people offered to help out a little with the serving and cleaning up, after all, we have cooked all the food.

Please don't think of me as a killjoy here, I normally love so much of what I read on Aish, but I wonder if considering this web site is primarily geared toward the Ba'al T'shuva, it would have been better to have posted next week's article first ? To tell you the honest truth, as someone who has been Shomer Shabbos since this past May and a guest in frum homes regularly since September, I found this first article very off-putting.

We as guests are not there to make our hosts want us back - we're there to learn what it is to keep Shabbos and to spend it with families instead of alone. I fully understand how frustrating it can be to host guests who don't have a clue about how to behave at the dinner table (or at the initial invitation for that matter). But this article sounded whiny and confrontational. I literally feel admonished by this article - not something I'm used to seeing on Aish.com as a newly frum person. Frankly, I'm surprised.

I also want to speak for a moment to the issue of helping to clean up. As a women first getting to know frum life, I was very disconcerted by the fact that after the meal was over, in 8 out of 10 homes, the men stayed at the table listening to divrei Torah while the women cleaned up. Frankly, as a someone being introduced to frum life, I was going to be dammed! if I was going to go into the kitchen like a dutiful wifely-like woman and miss out on fascinating Torah discussion. I DAVKA stayed at the table and refused to help clean up ! The best homes where I am happy to clean up and help out are those that don't let the kind of conversation that's been complained about this in article, and in some of the comments, even have a chance to take place because Torah talk is encouraged throughout the meal **by the hosts**. Any dvar Torah anyone has is given before benching, and then everyone helps out with cleaning up, as there is no longer a reason to stay at the table.

I hope next week we can talk about teaching your kids to behave in front of guests, spending more than $99 on a mattress and actually replacing it more than every 10 years, not using your storage room in the basement as a guest room (or vise versa), leaving your cholent pot in the kitchen where it belongs and not in the basement where the guest bed is because you can't stand the smell at night, "oh I hope you don't mind!" and making sure that if you insist on seating women on one side of the table and all the men at the head, that you at least have the decency to speak loudly enough for the women to hear when giving a dvar Torah. How's THAT for confrontational !

I commend Mrs. Braverman on another wonderful article. As a person who often hosts guests I have a few more points to add. In my community, we have a growing number of singles. We have found a tendency among them to be wary to commit to invitations. For instance, if I call on Sunday to invite someone for the following Friday night he or she may say, "I'm not sure." When I ask them if they have other tentative plans they'll say no. This always leads me to wonder if they're waiting for a better offer. Also, there is a tendency among many of them to call on Thursday to ask if they can come. As Mrs. Braverman wrote, planning, shopping and cooking takes time. By Thursday night, much of my cooking is done. We love when people invite themselves but we prefer if they do it by Wednesday, at the latest. Another point about saying "thank you;" even if a person brings a gift, it's always appropriate to say thank you when leaving.

How about: PLEASE don't come if you're sick!

We just had a shabbos guest who had the flu and gave it to our entire family. She was not careful about handling everything, close contact or anything for that matter.

My lone quibble is in the area of foreign languages. As a host, I would never take it as rudeness for someone from another country, or for someone with limited proficiency in my first language, to speak in a foreign tongue. Nor would I want to limit my guests to those who habve a high level of proficiency in my first language.

Some of my most delightful guests, and I would say some of my happiest experiences of hachnassas orchim, have been visitors or recent arrivals from faraway places. Once I was privileged to share my table with a number of members of a visiting dance troupe and only one, whom I had met on a university fellowship, jhad even a limited proficiency in my language. Yes, there were times that evening when I felt sad, even a bit frustrated, not knowing what they were saying among themselves, especially when it was clearly about the dinner or the surroundings or those in our household, but those times were the exception.

Perhaps the writer meant to warn against the use of a foreign language in a manner that implies secrecy or shuts others out of the conversation, as in the manner of some whispering. For that matter, whispering can be polite under some circumstances, I think, especially when it is to spare someone from embarassment ("psst, you have gravy on your nose").

Anonymous, the title of the article was Guest Etiquette. Ms. Braverman was not suggesting that hosts ought to strike off their invitation lists those guests who violate these rules; she was saying that considerate guests follow these rules. While a truly saintly host whose sole motivation is hachnassat orchim may re-invite rude and inconsiderate guests despite their boorishness, guests nevertheless have a responsibility to be courteous.

Another rule for the guests: Do not discuss the latest "R" rated movie or some other topic which would be inappropriate for children to hear. Also, terrorism, neighborhood crime and other topics that would scare children.

MORE LIKE THIS !!!

In your article "Guest Etiquette" you list "Etiquette Violation #1: Don't ignore your hosts and their other guests." What aobut when you are invited to visit someplace and the host has invited others to the meal ("local people") and the conversation excludes/ignores YOU the guest? It might be nice to have an article that addresses the "flip side" - "Host Etiquette"

We have childless friends and you would be amazed at how the other couples will talk about their children for hours. Once at a dinner party of theirs the host asked what the topic of conversation at the end of the table was, so a man actually replied, "Oh, you wouldn't know about this" or "Oh, you wouldn't be interested" or something to that effect.

I really appreciate your columns, and this one strikes home as well. I know we all can tell you which guests we're likely to have back soon, and which ones are unlikely to get a new invitation. I have a question and a comment to add to your list.

The question: at our children's school, several families have at least one parent who was born in another country. These families are trying to bring up their children bilingual, in the parent's native language. To do this, they often speak in their native language with their children in front of other school families. While I understand the rationale, it does seem a bit rude to me. What do you think?

The comment: I'd add a rule about helping out. The guests who don't get invited back to stay with us are those who don't pitch in, and expect to be catered to. We love hosting our friends, even for several days when they're from out of town, but we have busy lives and younger children, so it's tough when the guest sits on his or her hands and doesn't even offer to chip in to help prepare or clean up from meals, etc.

thanks as always for your great articles.

I am looking forward to reading the Host's next week. Again, Thank You
Good Shabbos

Although the humor of this article was not lost on me, I have an open home in a small city in Israel, and felt that this type of article is not really written from the perspective of a religious hostess, but from A WESTERN POINT OF VIEW. We should all be having guests at our tables because they need us, not because we need them. If they are rude, strange, removed or downright nasty, it is not what they can do for us, but what we can do for them. Can we show them positive ways of speaking to our children? Can we show them patience and understanding? What are we inviting them for, anyway? To get compliments and ego boosts? If this is the case, then I don't see where the mitzvah fits into the picture...