Did God Speak at Sinai?

This is a beautiful article. What i am still unclear about though, is what is the proof that the entire Torah was written by G-d. This article presents proof that G-d gave the Torah at Sinai, but the Jews only heard the first two commandments. So isnt it possible that while clearly G-d gave the Torah, maybe Moshe stuck in some parts of the Torah on his own? In short, what is the proof ALL parts of Torah - every letter, is written by G-d?

Absolutely brilliantly stated. It spoke about every instance that could make people disbelieve. I’m only sad that I had Grandparents who were not religious and one of them doubtful and believed Moshe wrote the Torah. Thank you so much for letting people see how it was G-d

I'm a believer in the revelation at Sinai. But even among sages disagreements as to what and how many of 10 commandments were heard. Just recently there was an election in the USA and approximately 50 million people without evidence believe it was stolen. The Torah itself is subject to interpretation so even among those who believe in the revelation at Sinai Hashem left man with the job of interpreting it for each generation. I believe that job is for believing shomer mitzvoth Jews to decide but the idea that everyone one hears x and this is what was said and what it means is not simple

I think scholars place the numberat around 60,000.

Torah states that there were 600,000 men between the ages of 20 and 50 (military age). If we make the reasonable assumptions that (1) there were 600,000 women of the same age; (2) there were two children per couple (younger couples might have no or only one child, older couples might have 3, 4, or more children, so a replacement estimate of two is reasonable), for a total of 1.2 million children under age 20; and (3) there were 600,000 elders over the age of 50, we get a total population of 3 million.

This is a highly thought-provoking article. Thank you for publishing it. As far as we can tell so far, Hashem did not create us with the ability to understand him. But by continually searching for the truth, and sharing with others the journey toward reaching it, we may one day find that all is "suddenly" revealed.

GREAT!!!

E

De Mille didn't make a 'mistake', he had to make Heston bigger as Moses and took what they call 'license' without truly contradicting anything. Interesting thing is that the film is still bottled up in an exclusive network play forever. Next to The Wizard of Oz (with its own religious themes) The Ten Commandments is only available on ABC in a license term that is, frankly, eternal. The film cost $13 million to make in 1956! So despite the 'creativity' it is a message that resonates to this day. Best line still comes from that little known Torah scholar himself Edward G Robinson, "Where's your Messiah now?" Thank you Billy Crystal. Great prose my friend and a very belated Alev Asholom to you Stu, Dave and the whole family about the loss of your father, a truly towering figure.

Thanks for getting me into Shavuous focus.

JG

Thank you very much for these deep thoughts . That said this seems to be
just the right length in word numbers and paragraphs. Not a complicated ,
impossible to put down till the very last word . That said, as it was so fascinating , I sensed a tad too much repetition ? It was easy to remember and even relish every word, which also means that any section being repeated risked a possible level of criticism ? Added to that , and on the following point , please correct me if I am mistaken, that ‘ Central to Jewish History ‘ , has been considered and uttered trillions of times over millennia , is in fact YERUSHALAYIM ? Yes, undoubtedly Sinai legitimately
has an unforgettable place in our past ! That said , more knowledgable
folk than me can add to that list of Jewish generational significances,
I look forward with a voracious appetite to your unique resposes ? Thanks ,
Shabbat Shalom to you and all your family and followers, Micha.....

Thank you for honest information. Please keep me up to date.

The Torah is often misread to prove a particular view. The Hebrew which we now know was a late development as a language known to us, as illustrated, by the script on the clay tablet dating to Babylonian exile times, could not have been written by Moses in its current form. We do know that there were at least 4 versions between that used by Ezra and the Masoretic Torah. It is of record that God spoke only to individuals not the mass of Israelites. The 10 statements were given to the refugees by Moses, not God . The persons at Sinai were asked by Moses if they accepted God and their positive reply was given by Moses to God. The believability and the hoax discussion again illustrates a point of view. One can always propose a hypothesis that will lead to desired results. The Torah of today is not even the one read by Ezra. Scribes have altered many of the statements in the torah. Days first appeared in the third act of creation. There was a first act of creation but not a first day!!

Hi, I do not understand what you wrote? Where is the record that God only spoke to individuals. All the records even the ones between Ezra and Masoretic say exactly as quoted above?

Since you are very kowledgeable, would you please provide the Ezra text you refer to? It would be nice to compare it to the current "versions". Torahs are copied from previous scrolls, letter by letter, by prepared scribes using special materials. Today this is refered to as "quality control". Google the oldest surviving Torah and you'll find that the text, as compared to the current one, varies ever so slightly, maybe two or three letters out of more than 305,000. The oldest known Torah which predates the Aleppo Codex, was in turn copied from earlier manuscripts which were copied from others. The problem is spelling. Take a look to the Dead Sea Scrolls as well.

The Torah we have today is the exact Torah athat was taugh to Moses 3,333
years ago.

As a Jew how do I know there was national revelation those many years ago? I went to yeshiva in Brooklyn on Marcy many years ago. Your reasoning intrigued me . Like to read more of your smaller books as I am now approaching 80 Believe in god e-mail me and I’ll give you my address and phone number thank you

Unique National revelation is comforting but putting a number on it puts a question mark over it. Where and when did the number appear. Could an elderly ex-slave say to his grandson or daughter " there was three million of us "?

I'm reading through the text now and it doesn't say anywhere that god spoke to the people. Can someone point out where exactly it says this.

Ten commandments spoken directly to all Israel

'Has a people ever heard the voice of God speaking from the midst of the fires as you have heard and survived?' (Deut. 4:32-33)

Add Duet. 5:22-27 to above quotations, as they also clearly support Ex. 19:9

excellent article
G-D bless you

this isn't proof god (as in creator of the universe) spoke at sinai. it's as near as we're going to get of proof that a being who had the audacity to call themself "god" spoke at sinai - most likely with the help of an amplifier. but not the creator of the universe.

Where exactly would he get this amplifier, 3000 years ago?

Hello!!! your forgetting it says they saw god!, forget the amplifier

That must have been some powerful amplifier, to be able to clearly reach 600000 men, plus, women, children, elderly. I'm not sure we have the technology for that yet. Do you believe aliens are responsible? For what purpose?

Avi, you are absolutely correct. It could have been an alien college student prank with technology far beyond our own that was driving by earth on his way to a toga party somewhere else in the galaxy and decided to have some fun with a bunch of primitive ants. The book left behind might have very easily been a draft to a thesis paper. All we know for now is that 3mm people were witnesses to the event. That is all.

The leap of faith comes not from the revelation, but from the belief in who the source truly was. Just as easily could have been the Creator Himself.

Here's the thing, though. The thesis paper does not only describe events that happened in the past, but events that will happen in the future. One day we will be able to verify those events (if and when they happen). E.g. the coming of the Messiah.

Problem is...G-d created us with free will. We could either accept the accounts and predictions in the Bible, or we could not. That's up to us. Even when the Messiah comes, we could have doubt - after all, the alien college student could have had some technology that predicts the future. That's the "problem" with faith and free will.

G-d's existence, however, as the Creator of the Universe, is undeniable. Science and technology will never be able to explain away the Creator.

In the meantime, Judaism teaches love, peace, and respect for one another. It provides a structure for a healthy family and a thriving community. Whether Judaism *is* the word of G-d becomes secondary. If the Bible turns out to be an alien college paper dropped to us as a prank, well...that student deserves an A .

What makes me a Jew is my belief in one god as the Almighty Creator. Not because the Bible says so, but because that is the only explanation for everything in the Universe. No other religion fits the mold of that Almighty Creator. The Bible...well...it's a nice guide to daily living until the ultimate truth is revealed to me.

A creator is the only explanation for the universe? Why? Then you're assuming this guy had no beginning or end? Why would you assume such a thing? It seems to me that any existence of a creator needs a reason or cause of this being. If He was always fully formed, and conscious, why would he have to think up and create anything? When would the idea of creating ANYTHING suddenly appear in his mind, and then cause Him to act on this SUDDEN vision? Why is this more likely than a natural dislodgement of chemicals falling into life-giving combinations. Why is the ignition of these events more likely to have been purposely activated, than a random occurrence?

I have been a member of the LDS faith, tried to understand Islam and just recently tried to become Christian. But in the end I had more questions than answers. I knew that my mom was a Jew from Germany, so I thought I would check Judaism out, and it feels so RIGHT and TRUTHFUL!

I've heard some of these arguments before but never in so coherent a fashion. It's enough to make a reader believe the truth of Sinai. I just don't get how, after G-d took the trouble to speak to the Nation, they still regressed nearly immediately. If they were that foolish, G-d should have made a nation of Moses.

So G-d can't redo His revelation, nationally, to confirm it to a different generation?

Anything he wants to do but who will not do it. Israel is God's people. We were the first to be chosen to spread the truth that there is only ONE God. All souls that were to become souls were there. Good does not become man and no man can become God.

I have been brought up in the Christian faith, but have lacked faith when are ministers say God had spoken to them, this artical has explained a lot to me and belief in God thankyou

One of the most important questions in TORAH is, "Was Moshe schizophrenic & hearing voices in his head or was God really talking to him? If Moshe WAS schizophrenic then the whole Chosen People & Promised Land thing is dead in the water & the Arabs have as much right to the land as anyone else. If YHWH was REALLY talking to Moshe, then He was the FIRST anti-Semite! Exodus 32:7-10 7 At the same time, the LORD said to Moses, “Go down from this mountain. Your people, the people you brought out of the land of Egypt, have committed a terrible sin. 8 They have very quickly turned away from what I commanded them to do. They made a calf from melted gold for themselves. They are worshiping that calf (Moloch) and making HUMAN sacrifices to it. The people have said, ‘Israel, these are the gods that led you out of Egypt.’” 9 The LORD said to Moses, “I have seen these people, and I know that they are very stubborn. They will always turn against me. 10 So now let me DESTROY THEM in anger. Then I will make a great nation from you.”

Fool!! The whole, entire nation heard G-d speaking directly to them! They weren't all schizophrenic and hearing voices! ergo, everything that is in that Torah is true, including Moshe's refusal to have Bnei Yisroel distroyed and a new nation made from him. Bnei Yisroel did teshuvah, and their lineage continued to be the am nivchar. Are you a missionary? You sure sound like it, with your lies and half-truths.

This article by the Rabbi's is brilliant in truth. The national revelation of God to Israel is foundational to faith in the God of Abraham, Isaac and Jacob. I'm a Judeo Christian. If I'm wrong about Jesus as Messiah please help me. But if "anonymous" is refering to the "missionary" as Christian, please understand that there are many of us in Christianity teaching this same truth the Rabbi's teach in this article. Please forgive those in Christianity that have divorced themselves from Judaism and taught against national revelation. Thank you Aish.com for the great article.

You write "If I'm wrong about Jesus as Messiah, please help me". With pleasure. Please see "Why Jews don't believe in Jesus" on this site.

Moses alone did not hear the voice: THREE MILLION people heard God's voice. If ONLY MOSES heard the voice then there is no Judaism! But everyone heard the voice. How else could see be still one nation. God promised the land not on My. Sinai but to our fathers: Abra I am, Issac, and Jacob.

Where is the proof that 3 million people heard God's Voice?

'Has a people ever heard the voice of God speaking from the midst of the fires as you have heard and survived?' (Deut. 4:32-33)

What impressed me regarding the whole Exodus narrative, was that Moses was brought up in the house of Pharoah, so his knowledge of Israel's culture and traditions would have been extremely limited. He appears on the scene rather suddenly, and declares that Israel's deity has revealed that he (Moses), was going to deliver their entire nation from Egypt. The nation of Israel must have been extremely sceptical. What could have convinced them that this man, brought up in the mysteries of the Egytptian religion, and perhaps slated to take up the throne of Egypt, should sympathize with their plight, know anything about their deity, and be qualified to instruct them about their form of worship towards their deity, or their mores. Israel must have come to realize very quickly that Moses' claims would indeed have to be true. No way Moses, an uneducated man in the mores of Israel should have had such an extensive knowledge of their oral traditions, the sacrifices and holy days their forefathers had handed down to them, except he had obtained it from direct revelation from the deity. The elders within Israel must have picked up on this very early. The majority of the nation it appears were either ignorant of the traditions or lax in their practice, and had adopted much of the religious practices of the Egyptians, as we see later in the narritive with the golden calf and their desire to return to Egypt. Israel's scepticism in regards to Moses must have quickly evaporated when they saw their deity in essence making a mockery of the Egyptian gods and religion through Moses' announced plagues and pestilences. Then his position secured when he zealously reintroduced them to their oral traditions, and strictly adhered to them himself, truly leaving Egypt behind. The icing on the cake as they say, was when the deity took up a relationship with the entire nation, as they had only previously heard tales of with their patriarchs, speaking to Him face to face.

After reading the articles in this site I can clearly see no 'holes' in the answers to questions about the Jewish religon. I was rasied to be a Christian, but as a teen begain to see the holes in that belief. I know I belive in God, but have no religon. This site is VERY informative and has left me wanting for more! Thanks

Good article, and i am inclined to agree with your strength of argument, in fact, anyone with a modicum of rational thought within themselves really should arrive at similar conclusions...however! I don't think it's entirely impossible to 'hoax' the masses. In fact, presently the current media is that closely controlled that it could have the majority of the planet, never mind a single nation, believing in one thing or another. I find it hard to believe the entire populace of a nation was gathered at the foot of a mountain, for numerous reasons, what about the sick, elderly, giving birth, imprisoned etc..? So convince a large number of people, and that is then spread amongst the populace seems more reasonable. Today, having, say, a stadium full of people and convincing them of something then letting that spread to a populace of 3 million or so, which is not a lot, isn't impossible, remember we are talking 3000 years ago roughly, no internet then. Also given the right circumstances, the leader/s of a small nation possibly could enforce new beliefs as truth, through the teaching this to children, and after generation and generation, as long as this 'truth' is taught it may well be the case that somewhere down those generations it's taken as fact. There are other arguments too, mass halucinations, misunderstanding of events etc...maybe with less credence but exist nonetheless. Anyway, your reasoning is sound, and yes no other religion can make this claim, and i'm certainly not being disparaging or refuting any religious claim, but i felt compelled to argue that however improbable a hoax, it's not impossible.

As I read your respomce, i thought of the answer; no one imprisoned would nessseccerily by out of the "loop', the sick, would have heard, and the elderly in Hebre4w families use to be with their kinfolk. So all could have heard. Also, could a mericle of no sick, or weak persons? Or few, anyway. Thank you for the inquary. We do need to tink of these items, so we can reflut the refluters.

Let's consider the option that God did not write the Torah, and its author successfully convinced a group of people to accept a false claim of national revelation. In this book, the author writes a prediction that over the course of history no one will ever make a similar claim. That means if such a claim is ever made at some future time, the prediction will end up being false and his religion is finished. How could the author include in the book he is passing off as a hoax the prediction that no other person will ever attempt to perpetuate the same hoax when he just made that exact claim? If he could do it, he can be certain that others will too, especially since it is the best possible claim to make. If you are making up a religion, you do not write something you know you cannot predict and whose outcome you would think is guaranteed to be exactly the opposite.

AWSOME!

This is all very interesting indeed

"Johnny Appleseed planting apple trees across America with his discarded apple cores is another legend." NO, not a legend. Is truth. John Chapman is the name. Did plant apple sees where ever he went in the Ohio river basin, at that time still American Indian territory. Was called "Big Medicine" by the American Indian as he knew healing powers and remedies. Truth!!

In response to the previous remarks that seem to be indicating that since certain individuals' claims that the holocaust never occured somehow refutes the logic presented in the article, it is irrelevant what a small group of extremests purport, the fact of the matter is that history records and will continue to record the truth of the holocaust, which was witnessed by millions. I agree whole-heartedly with the logic presented in the article, however I would like to point out the other major religions of the world follow the interpretations and ispirations of their prophet. Their numbers far exceed the Jewish people, billions of Christians and Muslims. Only jews are forbidden to have no image of G-d. Therefore I would say that Hashem was indeed working through these prophets, converting so many people from paganism to monotheism. Certainly their beliefs and practices are now far removed from the idolatry they were practicing prior to their conversion in ancient times. Not everyone can be or is supposed to be a Jew, it takes a high level of committment and development. Other nations had prophets who could validly hear the voice of Hashem, the Torah tells us so. Certainly Hashem created these prophets for his purpose, and used them to bring people closer to him and his ways. Revelation to the multitudes is the best and highest form of revelation, no doubt. And it points to the highest expression of Hashem's truth. But the article seemed to be saying that the Prophets of other nations were utterly without merit, and to this point I disagree. I think Hashem is creating many roads to himself, some more direct than others.

Excellent article, well structured and clear, about the most central issue humanity has ever raised; does God exist? is the Torah the word of God? With this kind of logic, there is no need to be in a foxhole to stop being an Atheist.

I have recently come across some interesting Islamic verses in the Koran, the holy book of the Muslems. Even though this book is full of verses about punishment for failing to become a 'believer' in the Muslem sense, surprisingly (to me it was :-) the Koran seemed pretty clear abou stating that the Torah was indeed given to the Jewish people, and that the land of Israel does belong to the Jews, as a gift from Allah. Do the Palestinians know about those verses? You can look those verses up: surah 5;21-23 5;44 7;129 7;137 Hatzlacha 10;84 17;104

I am good in logic too and this argument is excellent! the fact that so many people deny the holocost is the modern version to understand how so many people deny sinai's revelation! but the fact that many people say that G-od doesnt exist dont prevent HIM to exist!!! there is a special picture on the wall we can see with special glasses and many people say that there isnt, they can tell what they want and believe what they want, the picture exists and stay on the wall!! is this article translated in hebrew please?? kol akavod! gmar hatima tova!!

Everyone knows they are lying. if fact in future generations when there are no more eyewitnesses this argument will be one of the most compelling claims to know the Holocaust happened and the physical evidence isn''t faked.

Applying your logic that something that happened to and was witnessed by large numbers of people is irrefutable, how is it that so many people now deny the Holocost - and get away with it? Logic notwithstanding, if an individual or any number of individuals decide to refuse to accept some fact as true, nothing: not logic, not eyewitnesses and not physical evidence will change their decision. Only the inherently honest are swayed by truth.

There is a class of gullible people who, if told something happened to them, immediately create the memory of it in their minds and then believe it really did happen. That said, they are a small percentage of any group and would be countered by the natural skeptics who always question everything! So the argument for believability based on numbers is sound.
Unfortunately, there are also many liars reinforcing each other....

If you read descriptions of the Jews in the desert, you will see that they were hardly the type of gullible people to fall for whatever Moses told them. They argue with him endlessly, disobey both Moses and God, and on at least two occasions express a temporary desire to return to Egypt. If they hadn't witnessed the revelation at Sinai, hadn't known with absolute clarity that God existed and was leading them, they would never have stuck with Moses.

Pascal only addressed the Christian issue "Does God exist" Pascal's Wager does not apply to because belief that God gave the Jews the Torah on Mt. Sinai does not have infinite reward to the non-Jew. But I have always liked this argument, even though I heard it after I was convinced to question the statement "There is no God". The Circumstances that caused me to "Look for God" was ... after an hour of explaining the theory of Calculus to a man, he asked me first "How do you prove a negative?". To which I responded "you can't" (actually, you can, but you would have to examine every possible place where the condition could exist to be able to prove that the condition did not exist) His second question to me was "How can you then prove that God does not exist?" That led to my examination of the assumptions I had been using, and if there was a chance that God did exist, I had a responsibility to learn what he wanted of me, and why he put me here.

Please be not too hasty in discarding the influence of one man's testimony as opposed to that of a nation. G-d made his covenant with Abram/Abraham because he could trust him to lead his family correctly. Abram was directed by G-d to leave Ur and go to a land G-d would show to him. In that land he received G-d's promise for him and his descendents. Archaeological research has found Ur. It existed. Could Ezra, so many centuries later have access to proof of the existence of Ur, let alone to the life of one lone man and his wife? Where would he have gotten the idea for placing his invention in such locales as Ur and Haran, and Egypt, if such an invention were his. He was a priest and therefore carried the knowledge of the history of the Jewish people, but there is no indication he knew about ancient Babylonian and Assyrian history. And why start thee anyway? If it was nothing but an invention, why not have Abram born in Canaan? Egypt he would have known. But Haran? Ur? For that matter, would Moses? Maybe. He might have had access to old Egyption records that could have mentioned them. But again there is no proof. It was Abraham's faith that began the march to Sinai. Was his faith founded on a revelation from G-d or some long held remnant of knowledge transmitted generation to generation from the beginning of the creation of man? NO physical proof is available in almost any instance, but agonizingly slowly more is coming to light. Because I have not seen something or experienced something personally does not negate its existence, nor make it a lie.

It seems that whenever anyone hears this piece of evidence for the torah, including myself i admit, the wheels start cranking in our heads to come up with plausible scenarios, one after another. I heard a rabbi once explain this problem. he said that we can always come up with a possible way to explain the millions of people in every generation believing in sinai starting out with some natural event. and each time, it's a little easier to believe. we get a better, more refined explanation, and it becomes more difficult to tell whether or not the sinai story should be believed. he gives an analogy: you are the editor of the world publication of a science journal, and someone sends you a research paper to be published, with extensive testing and documentation, control experiments etc, the results of which show that chickens hatched in environments between 70-80 degrees fahrenheit, one out of a thousand will come out with three legs. and what would you do with such a paper? he says you throw it in the waste can. because the conditions are very common, and out of millions of chickens every year, no one has ever seen a three legged chicken (maybe one). so no matter how good the explanation, and how well documented the evidence, you don't see the results in the real world, even though the claim is that they should be fairly common. even not knowing where the flaw is, you know already there is a flaw. this sinai business is the same kind of thing. everyone comes up with a great way to explain how it must've happened, how stories like this get started, how easy it would be to fool all those people. but nowhere in all of history do we have so much as a hint of a group even trying to pull it off. tens of thousands of religions, and this plausible, natural, easy to perform deception has never even been attempted. so the ease with which we dismiss it, and the many ways we come up with to explain it away, none of them are realistic, real world realities, just intuitions we have about how easy it would be. and these intuitions are incorrect intuitions. they're not workable enough to have ever even occurred once in all of known human history. a long line of snake oil salesmen and prophets popping out of caves with "news" for everyone else, and we have a single, unique case of a people believing in a unique story, for thousands of years, and scores of generations. so every time a new explanation comes up, how about showing an example of that explanation having ever actually happened? also keep in mind that we have evidence in our favor, and the mere suggestion that there is a possibility of some other explanation being true, doesn't follow with any practical result. you will always be able to come up with an explanation for anything not being true. try to come up with reasons why there really isn't a place called "russia". maybe it's just a big hoax? just another three legged chicken...

The problem with this is that many
simple minded people can be made to believe or will agree to believe that they heard God simply because they would appear to be the odd ones out (or the unblessed or un righteous) if they didn't. A bit like the emporers new clothes scenario. However I am not implying that God did not speak to Moses or that the ten commandments were indeed given to him. What I am saying is that in those troubled times it would be easier to lie on a large scale that God was actually heard. The process of truth quoted to support it as truth is not totally airtight
What I believe is the greater evidence of Gods presence is the constant supply of food and water to the people in the wilderness at that time. To say that if you have had a revelation from God that no one will believe you I would say does it really matter. If God has spoken to you spiritually and you have felt his presence that is primarily for you alone unless God has asked you to shout it from the roof tops. If others disbelieve that contact from God cannot occur more fool them. There's none so blind as those that cannot see. Here I will give you what to many is an unbelievable situation I have seen Ghosts in the roof space of the Houses of parliament in London many years ago
whilst working as a Telecommunications engineer, I queried without disclosing my encounter this matter with one of the Beefeaters that guarded St Stephens entrance at that building and we discussed unusual occuurrences one
he named as a regular occurence was the sighting of Five overall clad men near the central spires at 2:15pm. These were allegedly the spirits of five bricklayers who'se scaffolding (wooden) had collapsed. The time I saw them was exactly 2-15pm and yes they were wearing overalls and they were coming up the curved roof near the spire where the scaffold collapsed and they dissapeared despite there being
no other exit possible where they could have gone. Now you may not believe this But I personally know it's true so you can call me a liar forever and a day but you can never change my belief and the corroboration that I heard from only one man. Having a spiritual experience with God on a personal scale is of similar consequence. A man with an argument is no match for a man who has had a spiritual encounter with his creator.

Dennis

First off according to the Torah the revelation at Sinai occured in 1313 BCE and the Jews entered Israel 40 years later and began conquering the land in the name of Hashem as written in the Torah which seems to me to be not very much of a gap for people to believe an invented Torah. Also even though there are many Xians and secular Jews that are unfamiliar with the events doesn't negate the tradition and unbroken chain of history that observant Jews have kept in the millions every generation. Also there are many Jews seperated from mainstream Sephardic and Ashkenazi traditions (such as African Jews, etc)who keep the same memory of these events even though they have been seperated for thousands of years.

There is the possibility that the events that ocured on mount Sinai where staged with use of alchemy and a few other people behind the scenes. After all, they just came out of Egypt and that was the kind of things that made Egypt great. Another strong possibility is that the Hebrews collectively decided that such an story of devine revelation with the special effects would assure them to be feared and percieved as mighty in the eyes of all the nations for years and years to come.

After rereading the article a number of times, I found the flaw that was bothering me. In the case of Ezra, it would have been possible to believe that such an event had happened thousands of years prior. It could have plausibly just been forgotten. The proof, is, that none of our grandparents sat us down and told us that they heard from their parents etc. We only know because it's written in the Book. A book could have gotten lost. Also, look how many people think that only Moses heard the Voice. So you have to make a correction: Had Ezra been introducing something previously unheard of (theoretically because there's no such record), some people would have accepted it, and others would have rejected it, and then there would have been two camps. Since we know that this was no the case, we may conclude that they had known from before.

I have pasted below the question of an on-line sceptic with whom I sometimes learn. Your thoughts on addressing the question are appreciated......"I admit it's a better narrative than joesph smith finding some gold tablets in the woods. but the issue is that while our source claims the entire nation heard the revelation it doesn't prove that it happened if there was a long enough gap between the source and the happening to allow all with knowledge of the event to die out. this argument therefore presumes a contemporaneous writing down of the torah"

Thanks for the enlightened article.I just love aish. com
and enjoy it tremendously.
You answer all my questions.
Thanks!

This is all making sense now. I thank you. Another thing that I find very interesting is that when ever I have asked the pastor's of other faiths or priests to exsplain their faith in the, "bible," I receive the same answer.. "It is not for you to read and to understand.. you must wait for a priest of pastor to exspalin it to you so that you do not receive any self revelations and become misguided.".. and when I persist with my questions, I am then told to either leave them alone or that if I am truely obediant, then I would not ask any questions to understand what I was being told to belive. So, I beg the question of, "What are they afraid of? That I will find the truth if I search hard enough?"
However, I find your website and information informative and enlightening.. I thank you from the bottom of my heart.
Shalom.

In reading your article entitled "Did God Speak at Mt. Sinai", I found SEVERAL major logistical flaws in your argument that it had to have actually happened. Your primary counterpoint involves a hypothetical claim that the entire continent of North America sinking into the ocean in 1794, and no one remembering the event, therefore proving it to be false. Your argument therefore claims that the story of God speaking to 3 million Jews must be true because it is believed by millions of Jews today. The problem is that the analogy is weak. Here is how. 1) The story of what happened in 1794 would have been recognized by virtually the entire world, whereas we do not know how many Jews supposedly heard God's instruction. Claims of there having been 3 million of them may well be greatly exaggerated. There may have only been a few thousand of them following Moses, making it more likely that it did NOT really happen, because many fewer people than you believe may have been in the desert with Moses. Secondly your flood story took place only 200 years ago rather than 3300 years ago. MANY more of us today can reject a story that supposedly took place 208 years ago than can reject one that took place 3300 years ago. How many of us really know our ancestors were in the desert with Moses, versus how many know our ancestors were in North America 208 years ago? Please devise a better argument. It seems to me as if you intentionally chose a weak one. What if I claimed that 1000 years ago, twenty thousand people with whom I share a common ancestor all came together in one place and heard God declare them as his children? You may not believe it, but if I was well respected 2300 years ago in a time when science took a backseat to prophecy and mysticism, and I relayed the story to a few hundred of my closest relatives, THEY could easily believe it WITHOUT knowing which of their ancestors (if any) were there at the time it happened. And they might easily pass the story on to their relatives, etc., until it became so well known that it became a common myth after a few years. And then after a few more years it could become accepted as true IF the original story made special claims to be truth and not merely myth.

Ordinarily, your logic would be sound.

However, this is a unique situation in which Ezra could indeed have planted a memory of God speaking to the people at Sinai. For in Nehemia 9:17, does it not say that the Israelites of Moses' day did not remember the wonders God had performed only weeks before they arrived at Sinai? Doesn't Nehemia 9 say that the people didn't even remember to keep Sukkot from the time of Yahshua ben Nun to the day of Ezra? If they didn't pass down the memories of these things, how can you be so sure that they passed down the memory of God speaking at Sinai?

It seems obvious that upon our arrival in Jerusalem from the Babylonian captivity the people had little or no memory of the book of Moses. It would have been easy at that point to convince the people of many unverifiable legends.

Please note that I am only pointing out a problem with your logic as it applies in this case. I am not challenging the bible's claim that God did speak to us at Sinai, for I believe He did.

Where is the archaeological evidence that Moses existed, or that the Israelites ever lived in, let alone fled, Egypt? Why does there not seem to be any archaeological evidence from Egypt, especially considering that Moses was an adopted member of the royal family? Should there not be corroboration of the Exodus story?

This entire article is wondeful! Just one question: The whole argument is based on the fact that God spoke to the Jews at Sinai. But how do we know for sure that this happened; maybe Moshe did some kind of miracle, made a loud voice come from the mountain and lightning flash...And since we don't believe in Moshe due to the miracles that he did, and the fact that it was God Who actually spoke to us is not verifiable, the entire article is based on an assumption that cannot be verified!

(P.S. I don't mean to sound belligerent, but this ALMOST answered all of my questions and I just need this one thing clarified for it all to make sense...)

The article provides sufficient grounds to state that the Torah was not given to the Jews by Moses, and he was not the author, but it does not establish that in fact G-d gave the Torah to the Jews at Mt. Sinai.

How can a human being know whether he is communicating with G-d or some other advanced being? Can an insect distinguish between a moron and a genius?

Until the author of this article can satisfactorily answer the above questions, he can not prove that it was in fact that the Prime Mover (G-d) gave the Torah to the Jews.

This is a very good article, making a lot of sense. Thank you.

Good question! Thanks for sending it in.

I think the answer is as follows:
The Torah says:

'You might inquire about times long past, from the day that God created man
on earth, and from one end of heaven to the other: Has there ever been
anything like this great thing or has anything like it been heard? Has a
people ever heard the voice of God speaking from the midst of the fires as
you have heard and survived?' (Deut. 4:32-33)

The Torah is saying that at any given point in history you can look back and
scan the times and you will never hear of another people hearing the voice
of G-d and living. We can only look back at the past, once events have
occurred, but by applying this statement to any time in the future, the
Torah is clearly saying that there will never be another claim of national
revelation by a surviving group. Although the Torah was written thousands of
years ago, it is talking to today's generation and saying the same thing -
look throughout all of history - has a claim like this ever been heard? The
Torah is also talking to the generation that will be alive a thousand years
from now, and that generation will be reading the Torah's statement and will
be able scan the additional upcoming thousand years that will be added to
history, and will be unable to find any similar claim as the Jewish claim of
national revelation.

I hope this answers your question.

Nechemia Coopersmith

Most impressive. Were the facts nationally or personally revealed to you? :-) Okay okay, I'm kidding. I enjoyed the read very much and the research is top notch. Good work, sir!

Kudos to you! A well thought out article that explains the veracity of the Torah. Will it change people's thinking? Maybe, maybe not. But it does provide a good idea for group discussion

A very good plea for Judiasm. I am forwarding it, but I don't know if it will sway anyone or not. People believe what they want to believe. Very seldom can you say something that will make people go away with a new set of thoughts in their minds. I am always amazed when I find someone who has listened to what I have said and then acted upon it. But, I keep trying anyway.

Thank you for the clear explanations provided in both the Exodus and the Sinai articles.

This is the one of the most amazing articles I've read. You can be sure I will be quoting your words to many people...religious and non! Thank you for this burst of clarity!

My mother sent this article to me and I found it quite convincing, and educational...the whole point you were making made complete sense

I, for one, was glad to read this. It is annoying to learn that millions of people follow religions begun on the so called revelations of single individuals, as both the Mormons and the Jehovah's Witnesses claim. I appreciate that the Bible is full of the witness of many for its truths.

Thank you for a coherent way to explain my belief that the revelation at Sinai occurred. I am sure I will use it at the sedar next week.

amazingly well thought out, profesionally presented, and factually irrefutuable.
An astounding argument on an issue so foundational to our faith. Thank you for providing me with such strong intellectual grounds for believing...

How is it possible that after such a unique, all-embracing and powerful experience in which the whole people heard the voice of Hashem say the 10 Commandments, and saw what is normally heard and heard what is normally seen, and having promised to accept the Torah that they could then only 42 days later break one (or maybe two) of these mitzvot and worship the golden calf? We are on a much lower spiritual level, but I can think of no one who would be capable of such a thing.

Powerful and convincing. Thank you!